Genesis questions

[Torben Anschau]

Hi folks,
yesterday I've seen the "musical box" show in Frankfurt, where a original
genesis concert was redone. It was really amazing and I recommend it everyone
with the chance to see loving this kind of music.

While watching the musicians a few questions came up:

1. At the beginning of "In know what they like" there's an awful growling
sound. It nearly sounds like deep piano note getting looped. Anyone with a Idea
how this was made?

2. Another sound that always impressed me a lot: a metallic-reverse sounding
pad in the song "Supper's Ready" just before the callout: "A flower?" What's
that and how could I repoduce this sound without a sampler?

3. The band there used the original equipment from the old genesis. The
Synthesizer was a "Synthestra". Who knows what that was?

Torben

Moege der Inhalt wichtiger sein als die Form

[Rand Kelly]

On the cover of Genesis Live-you can clearly see Tony using an ARP
Odyssey..perhaps that is opening I know what i like in your wardrobe?

Pretty sure that is used on Selling and Lamb for the most part.

I will have to re-listen to Supper's soon to weigh in on your 2nd ?

[Mivarsh Faz]

***@webtv.net (Rand Kelly) wrote:

:On the cover of Genesis Live-you can clearly see Tony using an ARP
:Odyssey..perhaps that is opening I know what i like in your wardrobe?
:
:Pretty sure that is used on Selling and Lamb for the most part.

He was using an ARP Pro-Soloist on the last couple of albums with
Peter Gabriel (SEBTP and Lamb). On the next two he used an ARP 2600,
joined by a Roland string-synthesizer on _Wind & Wuthering_. _And Then
There Were Three_ consisted of the 2600 and Roland plus a Minimoog and
a Polymoog. _Duke_ and _Abacab_ were mostly ARP Quadra.
However, I think the deep, droning sound heard at the beginning
of "I Know What I Like" is actually not one of Tony's keyboards but
rather Mike Rutherford's bass pedals (I don't know what he was using
then, but eventually he did use a set of Moog Taurus pedals).

MIKE (a.k.a. "Progbear")

to reply, consult Sylvia Barbara Casterline of Global Corp. She'll
surely NET you a solution.

"Parece cosa de maligno. Los pianos no estallan por casualidad."
--Gabriel Garcia Marquez

N.P.:"Edge of Night"- M i r r o r / D a y b r e a k

[Torben Anschau]

Hi Progbear,

Post by Mivarsh Faz
He was using an ARP Pro-Soloist on the last couple of albums with
Peter Gabriel (SEBTP and Lamb).

From the seats it looked like a Soloist (size, shape and so on).
But I supposed to read something like that on the back. There wasn't anything
like ARP, only this word like synthestra or something like this. Maybe despite
of that it is an Pro Soloist.

Post by Mivarsh Faz
And Then
There Were Three_ consisted of the 2600 and Roland plus a Minimoog and
a Polymoog. _Duke_ and _Abacab_ were mostly ARP Quadra.

the larger the synths the poorer the playing?

Post by Mivarsh Faz
However, I think the deep, droning sound heard at the beginning
of "I Know What I Like" is actually not one of Tony's keyboards but
rather Mike Rutherford's bass pedals

At this show, the sound was done by the Keyboarder. Maybe it was a sample. The
Rutherfod-actor did have an Basspedal by the way and it gave these really deep
basses live - beutiful. The Hackett-actor therefore used a guitarsynth for the
solos.
But certainly the "tony Banks" was doing this noise. I always asked what that
could be. To my ears it sounds like a loop from a piano bass but I never heard
Genesis have worked with loops. Could it be a sound from the mellotron?

Torben

Moege der Inhalt wichtiger sein als die Form

[Torben Anschau]

Hi Rand

Post by Rand Kelly
On the cover of Genesis Live-you can clearly see Tony using an ARP

Odyssey..perhaps that is opening I know what i like in your wardrobe?

I'm not sure wether it's a synth at all. Do you know which sound I mean? It's
this deep rolling sound while Peter recalls the story...

In the show I've seen the musicians were told to use the real instruments from
Genesis (that means exactly their models not only the type). And it was
definitely not an ARP Odyssey.
It looked like one of those preset synths. I couldn't read any manufacturer the
only word I nearly could read was something like "Synthestra".

Post by Rand Kelly
I will have to re-listen to Supper's soon to weigh in on your 2nd ?

Hope you'll enjoy it...

Torben

Moege der Inhalt wichtiger sein als die Form

[Paul Ward]

Post by Rand Kelly
On the cover of Genesis Live-you can clearly see Tony using an ARP
Odyssey..perhaps that is opening I know what i like in your wardrobe?
Pretty sure that is used on Selling and Lamb for the most part.

Tony never used an Odyssey.

On the cover of 'Genesis Live' the wedge-shaped keyboard on top of the
Hammond is, I believe, Tony's Hohner Pianet - he used to put this through a
fuzz box to create some of the lead sounds (e.g. on 'The Musical Box'). At
the back of his rig is his mixer.

I think Tony's rig would be at this point:
Hamond T-series organ
Mellotron 400
Hohner Pianet
(RMI electric piano - maybe?)

No synth! The Pro-Solist arrived in time for 'Selling England by the Pound'.

P.

[Wes]

For Genesis Live Tony had 3 keyboards. The Hohner, the Hammond, and one of
KC's old Mark II mellotrons.

Wes

Post by Paul Ward

Post by Rand Kelly
On the cover of Genesis Live-you can clearly see Tony using an ARP
Odyssey..perhaps that is opening I know what i like in your wardrobe?
Pretty sure that is used on Selling and Lamb for the most part.

Tony never used an Odyssey.
On the cover of 'Genesis Live' the wedge-shaped keyboard on top of the
Hammond is, I believe, Tony's Hohner Pianet - he used to put this through a
fuzz box to create some of the lead sounds (e.g. on 'The Musical Box'). At
the back of his rig is his mixer.
Hamond T-series organ
Mellotron 400
Hohner Pianet
(RMI electric piano - maybe?)
No synth! The Pro-Solist arrived in time for 'Selling England by the Pound'.
P.

[Paul Ward]

Yeah, he preferred the Mk2 'tron to the 400, but I though maybe he'd moved
onto the 400 by then. My memory isn't what it used to be. Thanks for the
correction! I suppose he moved to the 400 on 'Selling England...' too? When
did the RMI arrive/leave the rig - 74-77?

I have a colour photo of Tony's rig (from his point of view) from around
1975/1976 where you can actually see the settings on the Pro-Solist and
Hammond. OK, OK, I know it's sad, but I've tried to match them and see how
it all sounds! Interesting...

P.

Post by Wes
For Genesis Live Tony had 3 keyboards. The Hohner, the Hammond, and one of
KC's old Mark II mellotrons.
Wes

Post by Paul Ward

Post by Rand Kelly
On the cover of Genesis Live-you can clearly see Tony using an ARP
Odyssey..perhaps that is opening I know what i like in your wardrobe?
Pretty sure that is used on Selling and Lamb for the most part.

Tony never used an Odyssey.
On the cover of 'Genesis Live' the wedge-shaped keyboard on top of the
Hammond is, I believe, Tony's Hohner Pianet - he used to put this

through

Post by Wes
a

Post by Paul Ward
fuzz box to create some of the lead sounds (e.g. on 'The Musical Box'). At
the back of his rig is his mixer.
Hamond T-series organ
Mellotron 400
Hohner Pianet
(RMI electric piano - maybe?)
No synth! The Pro-Solist arrived in time for 'Selling England by the

Pound'.

Post by Paul Ward
P.

[Paul Ward]

Here's a document I came across a number of years ago. I don't know the
source, but it looks fairly close, albeit with a couple of
mistakes/omissions I can spot (CE10 chorus was actually a CE-1 chorus,
'Watcher of the Skies' also featured Bass Accordian, for example)...

GENESIS KEYBOARD RIGS THROUGH THE AGES
From Genesis To Revelation
Acoustic Piano
Farfisa Organ

Trespass, Nursery Cryme, Foxtrot (1970 - 1973)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Hammond L-122 tonewheel organ, Leslie rotating speaker
Hohner Pianet, fuzz effect
Mellotron Mk II [Strings, Brass, Flute tapes]

Notes

On many occasions during this period, Banks would try to make the electric
piano sound as close to an electric guitar as possible. On pieces like
"Musical Box", he would put the Pianet through a fuzz box, while Hackett
would try to make his guitar sound like a synthesizer.

The "Watcher of the Skies" sound was created by putting both the organ and
the Mellotron strings/brass through the Leslie speaker, with a fair amount
of distortion added.

Selling England By The Pound (1973 - 1974)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Hammond L-122 tonewheel organ, Leslie rotating speaker
ARP Pro Soloist synthesizer
Hohner Pianet, fuzz effect
Mellotron M400 [Strings, Brass, Choir tapes]

Notes

During the later part of the tour, he replaced the Pianet with an RMI
Electra electronic piano.

The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway (1974 - 1975)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Hammond T102 tonewheel organ, Leslie rotating speaker
ARP Pro Soloist synthesizer
RMI Electronic Piano, fuzz effect
Mellotron M400 [Strings, Brass, Choir tapes]



A Trick of the Tail (1975 - 1976)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Hammond T102 tonewheel organ, Leslie rotating speaker
ARP Pro Soloist synthesizer (thru Leslie on "Robbery, Assault & Battery")
ARP 2600 synthesizer [studio only]
RMI Electronic Piano thru MXR Phase 100, Fender Blender fuzz ("Dance on a
Volcano") Mellotron M400 [Strings, Brass, Choir tapes]

Notes

Banks used Echoplex echo units for the ARP synths to make them less buzzy.
The Mellotron also went through an Echoplex to get a large stereo image. He
also used a parametric EQ on the Mellotron to cut high and low frequencies.

Those thunderous synth bass sounds came from the Moog Taurus pedal
synthesizer (played by Rutherford and Hackett).

Wind & Wuthering, Seconds Out (1976 - 1977)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Hammond T102 tonewheel organ thru MXR Phase 100, Boss CE10 chorus
ARP Pro Soloist synthesizer thru Roland RE-201 Space Echo
ARP 2600 synthesizer [studio only]
RMI Electronic Piano thru MXR Phase 100, Fender Blender fuzz
Mellotron M400 thru Roland RE-201 Space Echo
Roland String Synthesizer [studio only]
Fender Rhodes electric piano [studio only]

Notes

The Leslie rotating speaker was replaced by the MXR phaser. That swirling
"Afterglow" sound features the phaser effect with resonance. The Roland
string synth was used for "One For the Vine" and "All In A Mouse's Night",
while the Rhodes piano was used for "Your Own Special Way".



...And Then there Were Three... (1978)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Yamaha CP70 Electric Grand Piano thru Boss CE10 chorus
Hammond T102 tonewheel organ thru MXR Phase 100, Boss CE10 chorus
ARP 2600 synthesizer thru Roland RE-201 Space Echo
Polymoog synthesizer thru MXR Phase 100, MXR Distortion+
Mellotron M400 thru Roland RE-201 Space Echo, MXR 10-band graphic EQ
Roland String synthesizer [studio only]

Notes

Rutherford played a Roland GR-500 guitar synth, Stuermer an ARP Avatar
guitar synth. These can be heard on the live versions of "Ripples" and
"Burning Rope".



Duke (1980)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Yamaha CS80 synthesizer [studio only]
ARP 2600 synthesizer [studio only]
Polymoog synthesizer [studio only]
Yamaha CP70 Electric Grand Piano thru Boss CE10 chorus
Hammond T102 tonewheel organ thru MXR Phase 100 Boss CE10 chorus
ARP Quadra synthesizer
SCI Prophet-5 synthesizer
Roland VP330 vocoder, choir & strings

Notes

The Yamaha CS80 synth was used extensively in the studio. Most synth sounds
on this album came from that synth. For those fast horn-type sounds, they
put the CS80 through a 'duck' which enabled Phil and Tony to trigger the
sounds with the mouth.

The VP330 replaced the poor old Mellotron. The vocoder section was mainly
used for "Duchess". MXR Digital Delay effects replaced the tape based Roland
Space Echo units.

Rutherford and Stuermer used Roland GR-500 and ARP Avatar guitar synths
during the tour.

Abacab, Three Sides Live (1981 - 1982)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Yamaha CS80 synthesizer [studio only]
Yamaha CP70 Electric Grand Piano thru Boss CE10 chorus
ARP Quadra synthesizer
SCI Prophet-10 synthesizer
SCI Prophet-5 synthesizer
Roland VP330 vocoder, choir & strings
EDP Wasp synthesizer [studio only]

Notes

The Prophet-10 replaces the Hammond organ. The organ sound is produced by
tuning the Prophet's four oscillators in octaves (sometimes adding a fifth)
and cutting highs and lows with the built in EQ. The output then goes
through the usual MXR phaser and Boss chorus.

The Abacab sound consists of the Quadra's duophonic lead section layered on
top of the polysynth section with distortion.

The CS80 was also put through a fuzz box for the "Dodo" main riff. For
"Whodunnit?", he 'played' the Prophet-5's patch change switches, constantly
alternating between 3 or 4 patches while holding down one or two keys.

Delay effects by MXR and Lexicon digital delays.



Genesis (1983)
Yamaha CP70 Electric Grand Piano thru Boss CE10 chorus
NED Synclavier II digital synthesizer
ARP Quadra synthesizer
SCI Prophet-10 synthesizer
E-mu Emulator sampler
Roland VP330 vocoder [studio only]

Notes

The $20,000 Synclavier was used for the high pitched "Mama" sound, the organ
on "That's All", the xylophone sound on "Home By The Sea", and the "Second
Home By The Sea" lead synth, among others.

The Emulator was used for the trumpet sound in "Just A Job To Do", and the
orchestral intro to "It's Gonna Get Better".

Invisible Touch (1986 - 1987)
Yamaha CP70B Electric Grand Piano (w/MIDI)
NED Synclavier II digital synthesizer
E-mu Emulator II sampler
ARP Quadra synthesizer (w/MIDI)
SCI Prophet-10 synthesizer (w/MIDI)
Yamaha DX7 synthesizer
Akai S900 sampler
Korg DVP voice processor
Roland MKS80 polysynth
Yamaha TX816 (eight DX7s in a rack)
Syco Systems MIDI switcher

We Can't Dance (1991 - 1992)
Rhodes MK80 digital piano / mother keyboard
Roland JD800 synthesizer
Korg Wavestation synthesizer
Ensoniq SD1 synthesizer
Ensoniq VFX synthesizer [studio only]
Roland VK-1000 digital organ/electric piano [studio only]
Rack: E-mu Emulator Three
E-mu Proteus (four units with custom samples, one regular)
Voce DMI-64 Mk II digital organ module (two units)
Miditemp PMM88 MIDI patchbay with remote controller
Various MIDI modules and effects

Notes

The Wavestation and JD800 were the main synths on the studio album. The
electric piano on "I Can't Dance" was played on the VK-1000.

Rutherford replaced his Taurus bass pedals with a 1.5 octave pedal board and
a Moog Source synth.

[Wes]

My notes below.

Wes

Post by Paul Ward
Here's a document I came across a number of years ago. I don't know the
source, but it looks fairly close, albeit with a couple of
mistakes/omissions I can spot (CE10 chorus was actually a CE-1 chorus,
'Watcher of the Skies' also featured Bass Accordian, for example)...
GENESIS KEYBOARD RIGS THROUGH THE AGES
From Genesis To Revelation
Acoustic Piano
Farfisa Organ
Trespass, Nursery Cryme, Foxtrot (1970 - 1973)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Hammond L-122 tonewheel organ, Leslie rotating speaker
Hohner Pianet, fuzz effect
Mellotron Mk II [Strings, Brass, Flute tapes]
Notes
On many occasions during this period, Banks would try to make the electric
piano sound as close to an electric guitar as possible. On pieces like
"Musical Box", he would put the Pianet through a fuzz box, while Hackett
would try to make his guitar sound like a synthesizer.
The "Watcher of the Skies" sound was created by putting both the organ and
the Mellotron strings/brass through the Leslie speaker, with a fair amount
of distortion added.

The Mark 2 had more tapes than what is indicated above. What they were
exactly, I could not say.

Post by Paul Ward
Selling England By The Pound (1973 - 1974)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Hammond L-122 tonewheel organ, Leslie rotating speaker
ARP Pro Soloist synthesizer
Hohner Pianet, fuzz effect
Mellotron M400 [Strings, Brass, Choir tapes]
Notes
During the later part of the tour, he replaced the Pianet with an RMI
Electra electronic piano.

I would question this electric piano comment. Having witnessed both SEbtP
tours in the US, the RMI was not involved in either. So if such a change
occured, it would have been very late in the second tour. Unless there was a
total failure of the Hohner, I am guessing that the RMI came on board for
tLLDoB.

Post by Paul Ward
The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway (1974 - 1975)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Hammond T102 tonewheel organ, Leslie rotating speaker
ARP Pro Soloist synthesizer
RMI Electronic Piano, fuzz effect
Mellotron M400 [Strings, Brass, Choir tapes]
A Trick of the Tail (1975 - 1976)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Hammond T102 tonewheel organ, Leslie rotating speaker
ARP Pro Soloist synthesizer (thru Leslie on "Robbery, Assault & Battery")
ARP 2600 synthesizer [studio only]
RMI Electronic Piano thru MXR Phase 100, Fender Blender fuzz ("Dance on a
Volcano") Mellotron M400 [Strings, Brass, Choir tapes]
Notes
Banks used Echoplex echo units for the ARP synths to make them less buzzy.
The Mellotron also went through an Echoplex to get a large stereo image. He
also used a parametric EQ on the Mellotron to cut high and low

frequencies.

Post by Paul Ward
Those thunderous synth bass sounds came from the Moog Taurus pedal
synthesizer (played by Rutherford and Hackett).
Wind & Wuthering, Seconds Out (1976 - 1977)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Hammond T102 tonewheel organ thru MXR Phase 100, Boss CE10 chorus
ARP Pro Soloist synthesizer thru Roland RE-201 Space Echo
ARP 2600 synthesizer [studio only]
RMI Electronic Piano thru MXR Phase 100, Fender Blender fuzz
Mellotron M400 thru Roland RE-201 Space Echo
Roland String Synthesizer [studio only]
Fender Rhodes electric piano [studio only]
Notes
The Leslie rotating speaker was replaced by the MXR phaser. That swirling
"Afterglow" sound features the phaser effect with resonance. The Roland
string synth was used for "One For the Vine" and "All In A Mouse's Night",
while the Rhodes piano was used for "Your Own Special Way".
...And Then there Were Three... (1978)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Yamaha CP70 Electric Grand Piano thru Boss CE10 chorus
Hammond T102 tonewheel organ thru MXR Phase 100, Boss CE10 chorus
ARP 2600 synthesizer thru Roland RE-201 Space Echo
Polymoog synthesizer thru MXR Phase 100, MXR Distortion+
Mellotron M400 thru Roland RE-201 Space Echo, MXR 10-band graphic EQ
Roland String synthesizer [studio only]
Notes
Rutherford played a Roland GR-500 guitar synth, Stuermer an ARP Avatar
guitar synth. These can be heard on the live versions of "Ripples" and
"Burning Rope".
Duke (1980)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Yamaha CS80 synthesizer [studio only]
ARP 2600 synthesizer [studio only]
Polymoog synthesizer [studio only]
Yamaha CP70 Electric Grand Piano thru Boss CE10 chorus
Hammond T102 tonewheel organ thru MXR Phase 100 Boss CE10 chorus
ARP Quadra synthesizer
SCI Prophet-5 synthesizer
Roland VP330 vocoder, choir & strings
Notes
The Yamaha CS80 synth was used extensively in the studio. Most synth sounds
on this album came from that synth. For those fast horn-type sounds, they
put the CS80 through a 'duck' which enabled Phil and Tony to trigger the
sounds with the mouth.
The VP330 replaced the poor old Mellotron. The vocoder section was mainly
used for "Duchess". MXR Digital Delay effects replaced the tape based Roland
Space Echo units.
Rutherford and Stuermer used Roland GR-500 and ARP Avatar guitar synths
during the tour.
Abacab, Three Sides Live (1981 - 1982)
Acoustic Piano [studio only]
Yamaha CS80 synthesizer [studio only]
Yamaha CP70 Electric Grand Piano thru Boss CE10 chorus
ARP Quadra synthesizer
SCI Prophet-10 synthesizer
SCI Prophet-5 synthesizer
Roland VP330 vocoder, choir & strings
EDP Wasp synthesizer [studio only]
Notes
The Prophet-10 replaces the Hammond organ. The organ sound is produced by
tuning the Prophet's four oscillators in octaves (sometimes adding a fifth)
and cutting highs and lows with the built in EQ. The output then goes
through the usual MXR phaser and Boss chorus.
The Abacab sound consists of the Quadra's duophonic lead section layered on
top of the polysynth section with distortion.
The CS80 was also put through a fuzz box for the "Dodo" main riff. For
"Whodunnit?", he 'played' the Prophet-5's patch change switches, constantly
alternating between 3 or 4 patches while holding down one or two keys.
Delay effects by MXR and Lexicon digital delays.
Genesis (1983)
Yamaha CP70 Electric Grand Piano thru Boss CE10 chorus
NED Synclavier II digital synthesizer
ARP Quadra synthesizer
SCI Prophet-10 synthesizer
E-mu Emulator sampler
Roland VP330 vocoder [studio only]
Notes
The $20,000 Synclavier was used for the high pitched "Mama" sound, the organ
on "That's All", the xylophone sound on "Home By The Sea", and the "Second
Home By The Sea" lead synth, among others.
The Emulator was used for the trumpet sound in "Just A Job To Do", and the
orchestral intro to "It's Gonna Get Better".
Invisible Touch (1986 - 1987)
Yamaha CP70B Electric Grand Piano (w/MIDI)
NED Synclavier II digital synthesizer
E-mu Emulator II sampler
ARP Quadra synthesizer (w/MIDI)

Hmmm, I question this Quadra with MIDI. It may be possible, but by this time
why not use a more suitable keyboard vs. the considerable expense to do
this.

Post by Paul Ward
SCI Prophet-10 synthesizer (w/MIDI)
Yamaha DX7 synthesizer
Akai S900 sampler
Korg DVP voice processor
Roland MKS80 polysynth
Yamaha TX816 (eight DX7s in a rack)
Syco Systems MIDI switcher
We Can't Dance (1991 - 1992)
Rhodes MK80 digital piano / mother keyboard
Roland JD800 synthesizer
Korg Wavestation synthesizer
Ensoniq SD1 synthesizer
Ensoniq VFX synthesizer [studio only]
Roland VK-1000 digital organ/electric piano [studio only]
Rack: E-mu Emulator Three
E-mu Proteus (four units with custom samples, one regular)
Voce DMI-64 Mk II digital organ module (two units)
Miditemp PMM88 MIDI patchbay with remote controller
Various MIDI modules and effects
Notes
The Wavestation and JD800 were the main synths on the studio album. The
electric piano on "I Can't Dance" was played on the VK-1000.
Rutherford replaced his Taurus bass pedals with a 1.5 octave pedal board and
a Moog Source synth.

[Torben Anschau]

Hi Paul

Post by Paul Ward
No synth! The Pro-Solist arrived in time for 'Selling England by the Pound'.

I always thought that but:
In supper's ready I always wonder if I don't hear a sound.

I have to hear it again, I tell you where, but I'm quite sure there's something
in that must have been a synth (apart from the bass pedals and guitar synths)

Torben

Moege der Inhalt wichtiger sein als die Form

[Paul Ward]

Post by Torben Anschau
I have to hear it again, I tell you where, but I'm quite sure there's something
in that must have been a synth (apart from the bass pedals and guitar synths)

No guitar synths either. They arrived just prior to 'And Then There Were
Three'!

It is truly amazing the sounds they managed to conjure from such simple kit
actually.

P.

[Paul Ward]

Post by Torben Anschau
1. At the beginning of "In know what they like" there's an awful growling
sound. It nearly sounds like deep piano note getting looped. Anyone with a Idea
how this was made?

The title is actually 'I Know What I Like (In Your Wardrobe)'. Not bass
pedals (I have Taurus pedals, so can confirm this). Maybe a tape loop?

Post by Torben Anschau
2. Another sound that always impressed me a lot: a metallic-reverse sounding
pad in the song "Supper's Ready" just before the callout: "A flower?" What's
that and how could I repoduce this sound without a sampler?

I suspect this was the RMI Piano with a volume pedal cutting the attack off.

Post by Torben Anschau
3. The band there used the original equipment from the old genesis. The
Synthesizer was a "Synthestra". Who knows what that was?

Never heard of it - I just saw 'The Musical Box' two weeks ago (they were
very, very good) and they were using an ARP Pro-Soloist! Tony's main lead
synth was the ARP Pro-Soloist. You can nail just about every Genesis lead
synth sound from 1973 to 1976 down to some Pro-Soloist preset or other. He
supposedly used a 2600 in the studio, but I'm hard pushed to spot it!

Speaking of 'The Musical Box' I always wondered how some of the sections
from 'Cinema Show' could be done on a single Pro-Soloist, so I watched the
keyboard player like a hawk (sure enough he had to do some quick patch flips
and octave switching). I couldn't believe it when at the very same point I
run into real trouble he turned and played a MIDI synth!! If he has to do
that, then how the heck did Tony Banks achieve it back in the 70s!?!?!?

I've always been a bit of a sad Genesis freak, so I currently have a Hammond
T-202, ARP Pro-Solist and Moog Taurus bass pedals. Haven't managed to score
an RMI yet, but there's time. As for the Mellotron... I'll stick with my
sampler and M-Tron, thanks all the same!

P.

[Torben Anschau]

Hi Paul,

Post by Paul Ward
Not bass
pedals (I have Taurus pedals, so can confirm this). Maybe a tape loop?

That's what I guessed, but - from what source?

Post by Paul Ward
I suspect this was the RMI Piano with a volume pedal cutting the attack off.

Well that's possible - so how could one make a synth/keyboard sound like rmi
piano? Any PlugIns?
I knew RMI was used in Lamb lies down. I think the XG series (at least my
MU-80) has a sound like this. But not like the one in Supper's ready!

Post by Paul Ward
Never heard of it - I just saw 'The Musical Box' two weeks ago (they were
very, very good)

You telling me!

Post by Paul Ward
and they were using an ARP Pro-Soloist!

Alright, so it is the Soloist....

Post by Paul Ward
from 'Cinema Show' could be done on a single Pro-Soloist, so I watched the
keyboard player like a hawk (sure enough he had to do some quick patch flips
and octave switching)

So did I....

Post by Paul Ward
I couldn't believe it when at the very same point I
run into real trouble he turned and played a MIDI synth!! If he has to do
that, then how the heck did Tony Banks achieve it back in the 70s!?!?!?

As a state of the art keyboarder - who knows? Maybe he already got the Motif
other people got 30 years later?
I suppose he had two Soloists?



Moege der Inhalt wichtiger sein als die Form

[Paul Ward]

This post might be inappropriate. Click to display it.

[Torben Anschau]

Hi Paul,

Post by Paul Ward
Quite why Tony chose it we can
perhaps only guess, but it is certainly not a 'pro' synth by my standards.

A Pro synth is a synth for people who make profit with it. So when Tony uses it
is professional! My D-50 has once been the top professional synth by roland.
But I don't make profit out of it.... Do you? :-)

Post by Paul Ward
I'd guess it was designed to act as an add-on for home organists. But what
Tony *did* with this little synth is truly amazing - and can you imagine
those early Genesis songs without it?

I can imagine that wouldn't have taken notice of Genesis.... At the time I got
interested about Genesis I was interested in music made with synthesizers
mainly. That's the reason why first Nursery Crime and Foxtrot didn't seem so
interesting. Nowadays when I also look for Harmonies, Songs structures and so
on, these Albums are quite as interesting (though nursery crime still is the
"hardest to understand and enjoy-album).

Post by Paul Ward
Phil wanted
them to become a pop group, so it was maybe the right thing to do in that
context!

Exactly what I think. The Meaning of synthesizers in the musical context has
changed massively in the 80s. At the earlier times it was used mainly as a solo
Instrument by virtous musicians that looked for other possibilities to express
their emotions and capabilities. It just expanded the musical horizon. Then it
was used to make sounds and sound effects never heard before, building musical
landscapes (Floyd, Klaus Schulze, Tangerine Dream....).
After a time they became instruments that repoduced complex studio or orchestra
sounds live, loosing their solo meaning doing pads, brasses and so on. It's
nothing special anymore.
If you're reading a test of a synth in a magazine, what is going to be prized?
"Sounds fat, sounds like analogue and so on".
But "this is backwards going". I think we love these sounds, because we want
to sound like on the songs of that days.
Isn't it sad, that there isn't anyone who explores the limitations of say a
V-Synth and give new astonishing music to us? Where people in 20 Years try to
imitate that?

Post by Paul Ward
Tony had to work hard to get his sound pallette in the early days of
Genesis. It seems he really didn't get into true synthesis until around
1978. Before that it was a matter of putting preset sounds through pedals,
distorting, twisting and bending them. That seemed to be his most creative
time, so maybe there's a message in there for all of us...

I subscribe all of your words....

Torben

Moege der Inhalt wichtiger sein als die Form

[Paul Ward]

Post by Torben Anschau
A Pro synth is a synth for people who make profit with it. So when Tony uses it
is professional! My D-50 has once been the top professional synth by roland.
But I don't make profit out of it.... Do you? :-)

Well, I have to admit that the Soloist's (surprisingly good) bass sound has
made it onto one or two commerical recordings from my studio, so in that
context it is 'pro', but I wouldn't dare tour with it!!

P.

[Rand Kelly]

WOW!!!

you guys are goooooooood...lol


I concede after re-checking my cd of Live.

I was curious if the person with the details can also inform us what
T.B. used on Calling All Stations. I really enjoy that one.


Rand Kelly

[Torben Anschau]

Post by Paul Ward
Well, I have to admit that the Soloist's (surprisingly good) bass sound has
made it onto one or two commerical recordings from my studio, so in that

Could I know it?

Torben

Moege der Inhalt wichtiger sein als die Form

[Mivarsh Faz]

This post might be inappropriate. Click to display it.

[John Boegehold]

Post by Torben Anschau
1. At the beginning of "In know what they like" there's an awful growling
sound. It nearly sounds like deep piano note getting looped. Anyone with a Idea
how this was made?

The "awful growling sound" is the sound of a lawnmower


John B

[Paul Ward]

Post by John Boegehold

Post by Torben Anschau
1. At the beginning of "In know what they like" there's an awful growling
sound. It nearly sounds like deep piano note getting looped. Anyone with

a

Post by John Boegehold
Idea

Post by Torben Anschau
how this was made?

The "awful growling sound" is the sound of a lawnmower

It 'represents' the sound of a lawnmower, but my dad's mower never sounded
like that!

P.

[Torben Anschau]

Post by John Boegehold
The "awful growling sound" is the sound of a lawnmower

A loanmower? I never heard a loanmower going like this?

Torben

Moege der Inhalt wichtiger sein als die Form